with all respect to the intelligent women you have quoted here, these are not the most important arguments against mccain where abortion is concerned. one is not going to convince someone against abortion that it is okay; even if this is doable, it is, again, not the most important aspect of this issue.

all of us, pro-choice and pro-life alike, are interested in decreasing the number of abortions that happen in this country (and for the record, before i continue, i am pro-choice). i would bet my daughter's college fund that there will be fewer abortions under obama than there would be under mccain, whether or not roe vs. wade remains intact. the way to reduce abortions, like many things, is through education.

It bothers me so much that people think outlawing something will necessarily have the effect they want. People are people and if they want or need abortions they’ll get one. Law or no law.

This is all not to mention the health of the mothers that will surely be in jeopardy if abortions are not regulated, of course.

the best thing we can do for ourselves, for our daughters, and for theirs is to remove our emotion and opinions from the issue (easier said than done) and take a realisitc look at what can be done to provide women the environment that best supports good choices and to elect the person who will most likely foster that environment. right now, that is clearly barack obama.

Ok, I admit that I haven't read every one of the nearly 600 comments here, but I did read a lot of them, and a couple things pop out: none of the McCain/Palin supporters have explained why they're voting that way, unless it's based entirely on abortion. I'd like to believe political conversation amongst people who disagree is still possible, and I'd like to hear more than strident, repetitive, one-issue arguments about why anyone would vote M/P, because I just cannot figure it out.

And: for all the people who think women should just live with their mistakes, and need to take responsibility for their own choices before getting pregnant - how are we supposed to do that when sex education barely exists, and access to tools and techniques to make responsible choices is rapidly disappearing?

dooce - thanks for using your voice to reach so many. And thanks to everyone else who wrote thoughtful comments with useful information, and to everyone who is rightly outraged and ready to take action. Vote!

I've read many of the comments, starting at #1, and continuing on until I couldn't take it anymore.
I'm quite embarrassed at the lack of civility amongst the previous commenters.

I am pro-choice. I am a feminist. I believe that my body is my own. I will share it with whom I choose. I've never been in the situation where I have had to choose whether or not to have an abortion, and I hope that I never have to.

My family is pro-life through and through. We have had many conversations about this issue. I still love my family...completely.

I can NEVER imagine being as cruel to my parents as many of these commenters have been to one another and to Heather.

Regardless of your stance on this issue, we are all human, and deserve respect. There are differences of opinion on all matters, and I would HOPE that educational debate would be used, as opposed to name calling, hateful remarks and hurtful rhetoric. What is right for you may not be right fo the person sitting next to you...that does not make them an idiot.

I have a 2 year old daughter, and I would never introduce her to many of the people that have commented on this site. Your lanquage and mean-sprited comments show me that you would not be worried about the feelings of others, and definatly not be an appropriate role model for my daughter.

Maybe, we should focus a little bit on monitoring ourselves, role modeling appropriate behavior, and attempting to erase hate from our society, as opposed to worrying about the behavior and choices of others.

I'm sad and disappointed...not at the difference of opinion, but at the nasty way that many people have voiced their differences.

I am a pro-choice female but it took a lot of soul searching to get me there. The pro-choice movement frames the right to an abortion in a way that I feel is deeply disrespectful to women, mothers, and children. However, I decided that I have to trust that the small amount of women who have to make the agonizing decision to abort a pregnancy do so morally. It is not for me a decision about who has more right to life, mother or fetus, but a million other questions including quality of life and the capacity of a woman to care for a child.
I am seriously beginning to feel that so many issues in politics are dog and pony shows to keep the American people divided and not focusing on what politicians are really doing. It is not that the 3% of American women who will get an abortion or the many gay people who would like to marry ( I am pro gay marriage by the way but neither of the candidates are) do not matter. It is that while we are focusing on these issues decisions that affect the rights of all Americans are being made.
I feel that Obama and Mcain are not that different from one another and both have lied and smeared in this campaign and you don't have to believe me, just go out to factcheck.org and see for yourself. I do not believe leadership involves misleading, lying, or voting certain ways because one of your special interest groups asks you to. I am going to waste my vote this election and vote third party because I am tired of voting for people I do not trust and do not respect.
Melissia

From what I've read, even if Roe v. Wade is overturned, each state can make its own laws on abortion.
That will definitely increase tourism to blue states.
But the right to choose will not completely go away if Roe v. Wade is overturned.

Oh, and thank god I don't live in a red state.
I wouldn't last a minute.

Oh good Lord, the ignorance being shown here! One that tops most of them is #412 Gooddog said:

"And then there are the Dooce readers screaming Ugh, Socialism. What has capitalism as practiced in this country done for you? Paid your medical insurance? Sent your kids to college? Put money in your bank accounts and provided you with a pension? The rich have gotten richer and the poor, poorer and there are so many more of them. Without regulation, capitalism is injust and brutal."

Why don't you move to Venezuela or Cuba if you think so much of socialism you moron.

1-What has capitalism as practiced in this country done for you? Paid your medical insurance?

Yes and the house to sleep in, vacations to escape to, enough to give to the church and other worthy cause of MY choice ...

2-Put money in your bank accounts and provided you with a pension?

Yes and bought that lake property, putting money in 529 college funds and that cool '68 gold top Les Paul I always wanted.

The rich have gotten richer and the poor have gotten richer, We have the highest standard of living in the entire frigging world Gooddog. More TV's and cars percapita than anywhere. If you would get off your ass and participate in the best economy in the world instead of watchinf spongebobsquarepants all day maybe you would have a pot to piss in. You should probably read some of Thomas Jefferson's thoughts, “I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have”.

Here's the only reason to vote for Obama: "A government policy to rob Peter to pay Paul can be assured of the support of Paul."
George Bernard Shaw

Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
Winston Churchill

The recurrence of periods of depression and mass unemployment has discredited capitalism in the opinion of injudicious people. Yet these events are not the outcome of the operation of the free market. They are on the contrary the result of well-intentioned but ill-advised government interference with the market.
Ludwig von Mises,

“The goal of socialism is communism.”
Vladimir Lenin

Democracy extends the sphere of individual freedom; socialism restricts it. Democracy attaches all possible value to each man; socialism makes each man a mere agent, a mere number. Democracy and socialism have nothing in common but one word: equality. But notice the difference: while democracy seeks equality in liberty, socialism seeks equality in restraint and servitude.
Alexis de Tocqueville

“Socialism values equality more than liberty but delivers neither.”
Dennis Prager

To take from one, because it is thought that his own industry and that of his fathers has acquired too much, in order to spare others, who, or whose fathers have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, 'the guarantee to every one of a free exercise of his industry, and the fruits acquired by it.'
Thomas Jefferson

“Socialism is like a dream. Sooner or later you wake up to reality.”
Winston Churchill

“Socialism can only arrive by bicycle.”
Jose Antonio Viera Gallo

“The function of socialism is to raise suffering to a higher level.”
Norman Mailer

“Socialism in general has a record of failure so blatant that only an intellectual could ignore or evade it”
Thomas Sowell

Under communist rule in the Soviet Union, the 3 percent of agricultural land that was privately farmed by people who kept part of the profits from their efforts supplied the majority of all farm produce. It is not simply that bureaucracy is inefficient. Any form of production that is not based on material reward will not operate efficiently.
Steven E Plaut

“Socialism is the same as Communism, only better English”
George Bernard Shaw

“The Berlin Wall is the defining achievement of socialism”
George F. Will

Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy.
Winston Churchill

How do you tell a Communist? Well, it's someone who reads Marx and Lenin. And how do you tell an Anti-communist? It's someone who understands Marx and Lenin.
Ronald Reagan

Collectivism doesn't work because it's based on a faulty economic premise. There is no such thing as a person's 'fair share' of wealth. The gross national product is not a pizza that must be carefully divided because if I get too many slices, you have to eat the box. The economy is expandable and, in any practical sense, limitless. -- P.J. O'Rourke

Socialism is the doctrine that man has no right to exist for his own sake, that his life and his work do not belong to him, but belong to society, that the only justification of his existence is his service to society, and that society may dispose of him in any way it pleases for the sake of whatever it deems to be its own tribal, collective good.
Ayn Rand

Government cannot make man richer, but it can make him poorer.
Ludwig von Mises

"You can't get rid of poverty by giving people money."
P. J. O'Rourke

A liberal is someone who feels a great debt to his fellow man, which debt he proposes to pay off with your money."
G. Gordon Liddy

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."
C.S. Lewis

"The most fundamental fact about the ideas of the political left is that they do not work. Therefore we should not be surprised to find the left concentrated in institutions where ideas do not have to work in order to survive."
Thomas Sowell

"You cannot bring prosperity by discouraging thrift.
You cannot help small men by tearing down big men.
You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong.
You cannot lift the wage earner by pulling down the wage payer.
You cannot help the poor man by destroying the rich.
You cannot keep out of trouble by spending more than your income.
You cannot further brotherhood of men by inciting class hatred.
You cannot establish security on borrowed money.
You cannot build character and courage by taking away man's initiative and independence.
You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves."
Rev. William J. H. Boetcker

Talon, you're changing the argument.

An egg or sperm, surely with living cells as you state, die. A fertilized egg does not.

You can have various views on abortion, but I find your rationale for pro-choice odd. A fetus has ONLY the rights YOU choose to give it? It's all about YOU YOU YOU. That's kinda totalitarian, no?

There are alot of people who believe that fetus is a human life (not a potential one, a real one), and a defenseless one at that. You may not believe it's worthy of protection and only worthy of whatever "rights" YOU give it, but that doesn't make you correct. Since you speak so forcefully of "rights," please tell me where in the Constitution is says you have the "right" to an abortion? Roe is based on a Constitutional "right to privacy," but that ain't in there either. I'm not sure on what moral basis you say you have the "right" to abort other than you think a fetus is a parasite. By the way, what makes one woman's fetus a "parasite" and another's a "baby?" Is it the intent of the mother to carry it to full term? Women who have miscarriages mourn the loss of a "baby," not a "fetus." Regardless of the nomenclature, don't both fetuses have the same RIGHT to a chance at life, liberty and happiness? That, my angry friend, IS in the Constitution.

I'm very sorry at the loss of your child. I'm not really sure what it has to do with this debate other than to make an emotional appeal.

605:

Oh, is your two-year-old reading Dooce's blog? Wow! Impressive.
*snort*

Hey you have probably already seen this, then, but I think this young woman says it even better.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/10/15/233023/97/640/631928

Hi Heather - I just wanted to continue to encourage you in the next few weeks to ask people to reconsider voting for McCain. You do have influence and a great opportunity to make people think who otherwise might not. Pretty much everyone who reads my blog agrees with me, so I'm mostly just preaching to the choir - but you have a mixed readership so I'm grateful that you are doing what you can to help get Obama elected and encourage a better future for our kids.

Thank you.

www.naptimepolitico.com

620...STFU? Is that what qualifies as debate in your circles? Or, as someone stated earlier, are you melting down because someone has challenged your hardcore ideological beliefs?

I was oversimplifying for the masses, most of which, like you, need things simplified. Are you really equating birth control pills and miscarriages with the willful destruction of a fetus? Perhaps you should adjust your moral compass.

You can beat your chest and shout profanities as long as the day is long...it won't shut me up. I'm not afraid of the liberal fascists rising up in America these days. :)

i'm not as articulate as your friends, that's why i read you...i agree wholeheartedly that this issue might be one of the most important on which to base your vote, especially as a woman...you cannot govern my uterus

You implore us to read about this information from two blogs, so that we can be sickened like you are about McCain? I enjoy blogs for the entertainment value and for different perspectives, not because I believe they are accurate or trustworthy on any topic that is newsworthy. Stay off the politics, especially when your source is a blog.

lmao at all you "I'm done with you dooce"

Most of you will crawl back to see what Dooce has to say (mostly because you will really miss her) and will hate yourself for it, but you will not be able to resist.

Why?...Resistance is futile.

I am a single mom of a special-needs kid. (I mention this because some McCain supporters think that I should now feel an intimate connection with Palin. Not so much.) The thing is, now that I had my son, I can't imagine having chosen to give him up. But if I hadn't been a month away from graduating college and engaged (I later broke up with him because he was abusive), my choice may have been different. And I think part of what made choosing to continue the pregnancy easier was knowing that it was MY choice.

Now if the government says I'm not allowed to choose whether or not to continue my pregnancy, then where does it end? Will they start dictating how I act when I'm pregnant along with what I'm allowed to ingest or engage in? Then they start dictating who should be allowed to parent and who shouldn't. The Right already says homosexuals shouldn't be parents. So why not single moms? Or poor people?

And what happens if the Right gets it's way and the thousands of babies who are aborted each week are suddenly born? (Clearly this will not happen; I am being hypothetical for the sake of argument.) Who takes care of these children? Some of them will be taken care of by their parents. Some will be put up for adoption. And when they aren't all adopted or they are abandoned or neglected, who pays for foster care and how? And for those who would have chosen abortion for economic reasons comes the cost of food stamps, WIC programs, headstart child care, medicaid, child support recovery, and FIP/Welfare. All of the things the Right hates because the government shouldn't pay for pregnancies. Have they ever considered what happens next? Kind of like going to war without an exit strategy, a legitimate reason, or a way to rebuild the country we invaded.....

And the whole rape/incest thing. I think that pisses me off the most. Imagine every time you fill out a piece of information about yourself or your child and having to look at the spot where it says "father" knowing the name that belongs there is the name of a monster. It's hard enough with my son's father. CAN YOU IMAGINE? A baby?? The daily care of a BABY who cries and poops and costs lots of money and interrupts your life every hour of every day day and it's the result of rape???? To not only have memories but a constant physical reminder that you aren't allowed to hate? That you have to sacrifice for????

Of course the argument is to have the baby adopted instead. I still have to put my life on hold for NINE MONTHS while my belly swells and people ask me about baby names and due dates and daddies.

I think Obama nailed it when he said that he knows we can't all agree on the abortion issue, but we can agree that we want to decrease the number of unwanted pregnancies. And let me tell you, the Right does a crappy job of educating it's youth. They can preach abstinence all they want; their kids are still going to do whatever they CHOOSE to do. Just like me, the daughter of two conservatives. And because I wasn't properly educated -- just told to stay away -- I wound up a single mom that the government gets to support.

Actually, when I miscarried in 1998, I mourned the loss of a pregnancy. There was no baby in the picture. Or the ultrasound for that matter.

And yes. So far as my body is concerned, all that matters is ME. Period. MY intent gives the fetus the rights I choose. Period. Other women choose differently, but they can't force their beliefs on others. They TRY to, but ultimately, we will tell them to stuff it.

My point, in the end is this: abortion, like it or not is a medical procedure. It has been around long before it was legislated. And it will continue to be around no matter how many woman or men will insist it is their divine right to "speak for the unborn." They can speak for their own unborn...but they can't speak for mine. They can choose to NOT have an abortion. They can choose to believe whatever they wish about what constitutes life, but in the end, the abortion issue ends up being a bodily integrity issue. You CANNOT compromise the right to bodily integrity. If you say that a woman must carry a pregnancy to term and give birth, then it is not such a slippery slope to begin telling people that they must give blood, or they must donate bone marrow, or they must donate sperm, or they must give up part of their intestines...it all sounds ludicrous...because it IS. Women MUST have the right to choose. Some will choose to carry, some will choose to carry and adopt out, some will choose to keep it, some will choose to abort...for whatever their reasons are, they MUST be free to choose what happens to THEIR bodies.

THEIR rights, wishes, decisions, and ultimately their choices supersede whatever rights the fetus may have before viability. As I said, after viability, the state gives the fetus limited rights, and abortion at that time is so strictly regulated as to be a non-issue.

I don't tell pregnant women who say they're expecting a baby that they're wrong, and I don't tell women who have suffered a miscarriage that they didn't suffer a loss. I have a good deal of experience in grief counseling. But I also don't tell women who choose to keep their pregnancies that they are wrong, and I don't tell women who choose to abort that it is sunshine and daises. I don't tell woman who choose to give their baby up that they should have aborted, or they should keep the baby. By being pro-choice, it means I respect the woman, I respect her decisions, and I respect her right to make those choices without MY interference.

Period.

If you don't agree with abortion, don't have one. Most major religions are big on personal accountability. So if the reason is religious, it's still none of your (general population) business.

628...you're right, that is how racism works. I had to read your post twice because I wasn't sure what you said. I still don't think you said what you THINK you said. Obama is in this race because he's black. If he was another run of the mill white guy with a radical background (like Ayers), he'd be sitting at home watching Hillary and McCain debate the issues on TV. 95% of black Americans voting for Obama...THAT'S racism. Plain and simple.

629. Your statements reek of Eugenics. Talk about racism...wow. Advocating abortions for poor people since they can't take care of the babies? Classism, racism, all in one post. Scary. To think of the Supreme Court Justices YOU'D nominate. Chilling.

Talon, we'll agree to disagree. For the record, I've never tried to have it both ways. I agree that babies conceived through rape or incest are every bit as innocent as planned babies. People feel better about abortion in those cases because they rationalize that the baby would be hated or despised by the mother or some other reason like that. In those cases, some people seem to think the sensibilities of the mother outweight the right of the baby to pursue life, liberty and happiness. I don't. Your slippery slope arguments are simple fallacies. People say the same thing about gay marriage...legalizing gay marriage will lead to legalizing bestiality, incest, yada yada yada. Proponents of gay marriage laugh at that, and I laugh at your straw men.

I simply disagree with you that the rights of the baby start and end at you and your uterus. Being a man, I can't have an abortion but that doesn't mean I can't have my views (or my vote) regardless of what the more radical among you say.

Eloquent and lucid Ivan #629

sorry 'bout the double post.

You know, it always annoys me when bloggers DON'T mention politics. Are they not paying attention, do they not have opinions? Are they worried their opinions are going to piss people off? I don't know, but it just seems so *fake* if they can't ever bring up what's going on in the world around them.

I know you get a lot of crap like "just be funny, don't get political" and "I don't come here to read your political opinions", but screw those people. If they find the rest of your life enjoyable enough to read about every few days, then they should also have to deal with the fact that you are an actual human being, with actual *opinions* about various subjects.

Because you do talk politics, I have that much more respect for you.

Are you serious? Do you read the things you post? Everyone....THIS is what passes for intelligent commentary on the left. Dick cheese.

This is classic lefty behavior that we are witnessing throughout the country during this election cycle. People like, ahem, ANONYMOUS, don't like what you have to say so they resort to vile, profanity laced attacks in an attempt to shout you down. Naturally, it's all done as part of a mob or a single anonymous voice. If nobody can ID you, you can't get the crap kicked out of you for being a jackass in public.

Also note how this person calls others "narrow-minded," despite completely discounting and ridiculing any and all competing views. Nothing to counter or convince, just name calling and hatred. Talk about narrow minded. When somebody tells you they are "broadminded," or a "freethinker," that's usually the first sign are they are anything but.

Anonymous, please keep talking. It's tools like you that will eventually bury the left in America by exposing it for the hate filled, intolerant crowd they are.

Seriously? If you are basing your vote solely on the abortion issue then WAKE UP!! Don't you think there are more important issue's?

Feel sorry for me-I'm in AZ! I can't believe that we are still going red, even though anyone who has dealt with McCain can't stand the man! At least my whole family* (in laws included) are voting Obama.

*except my brother who still thinks Ron Paul is god on earth-don't ask, I think my Dad may have drop kicked him one time too many.

#90 - Laura, very well said.

I encourage everyone to go back and read this comment.

I'm for Obama - but I disagree with these statements. Because I'm pro-life. What makes me disagree with this is because being pro-life isn't necessarily about religion. It's about when you believe life begins and whether you believe that baby has rights, too.

I do believe in exceptions for the usual - rape, incest, life of the mother, yadda yadda... but anyone can cry rape. Trying to man that situation is a logistical nightmare and people who want abortions will get them - legally or otherwise. Wrong or right.

I think there are a lot more reasons for women, and men, to vote for Obama than this.. a lot of reasons that cross party and gender lines. And I think that with all the problems going on in our country right now, abortion should NOT be on the top of anyone's list when deciding who should be president.

Please 646, gimme a break. Don't give yourself that much credit. I'm a fighter pilot. I've heard (and seen) things that would make Blackbeard blush.

Liberals define delicacy. I don't serve with any...they won't fight for anything so they tend not to show up where people actually might get hurt. The only time people like you are tough is when they hide behind mobs, keyboards, and lawyers. I'm almost drunk enough right now to tell you to shut the fuck up, but I like to be respectful to women and effeminate men. I can't tell which you are, but it's pretty much one and the same where liberals are concerned.

650, You have obviously never been raped. Dealing with my rape was hard enough without having a daily, moving, vomit-inducing reminder of that torturous experience for 9 months, made more difficult only by the trauma of giving birth to that child. That is something I would never wish on anyone, and had you experienced the same, you wouldn't either.

Re: Alexa at Flotsam: Yes it takes courage to terminate a pregnancy.It takes a lot of courage to go against the grain of conscience which will never lie about abortion being wrong.It takes courage to live with inner condemnation, to shut the door to one's inner voice and create silence in the place where the truth can be heard.It is a known psychological,experiential,human fact that we can lie to ourselves and that we can close such doors,even if ultimately that lie within will not rest quiet though dormant a whole lifetime perhaps.It is a known fact that human beings do such things and justify to themselves and others such things. One only has to know themself to know this to true.

And......yet....here's why Obama is EQUALLY as extreme and why someone should think of the other side. How about "Abortion will kill me?"

http://bornalivetruth.org/

Seriously folks? Is it that hard to understand why people stand against abortion?

Heather,

I just want you to know that I absolutely agree with everything you say and I am glad that you are giving us your view because it makes me like you even more.

I wonder if the religious right know that the only reason the "church" is against abortion is because then you aren't making anymore future church members that they can then get their tithing from?

Look at the history of any church, whatever religion, and you will find that is the reason.

I've heard this before: If men could get pregnant, you could buy abortions at the grocery store!

And Heather, I will click on you way more times a day, so you will continue to get whatever you would get from the prolifers who say they are leaving!!

Rock on sista!!

Unless John McCain kills someone live on television, I cannot vote for Obama. Nothing else is a deal breaker compared with the ultra liberal agenda and shameful record of poor judgement by Obama. Nothing.

When I was pregnant (29 years ago) my doctor (and my ex-husband) encouraged me quite often to abort my fetus.

Why because I had a very difficult pregnancy. If was very inconvenient for me (and the ex!) to spend almost everyday in bed...in the hospital twice and sick everyday. My baby sister has cerebral palsy (a birth defect and not inherited) and that was a nervous consideration.

I decide to follow my heart, instinct as a mother and convictions. I went through with my pregnancy.

Eight months later my son was born. Since he was early, his fetal breathing system did not shut down and was in NICU. We traded a very small savings account for a child (via paying doctor and hospital bills.) It just made us want to try hard to provide for him and excel as a family.

About two weeks later, I took home a very healthy, bright, smart and thriving baby boy. He was on the honor roll as a child and recently made the President's List in college. My point...nothing was wrong with him.

Today he is 28 years old, married and leading a full, productive life with hope, dreams and aspirations. How may babies time was cut short because of inconvenience?

It's a really good thing I did what I did. Later, after being a two time non-smoking lung cancer survivor and developing autoimmune disorders I lost my ability to bear children in my early 30's. He was my only child. Had I aborted him, I would have been childless today.

Heather, I love you blog. I just don't vote on one issue...my life and experience has taught me better.

Heather, thank you for reminding me why I'll be voting for John McCain.

Wayne #396 - Dooce's been losing her edge for quite a while now, Alexa and other ranks plummeting steadily for the last 2 years. I actually feel sorry for her obvious scrabbling to keep her sheep baa-ing at her tackily clad heels. (Maybe she gets a blog award here and there - easy to do when you get all your friends to suck up and vote for you.)

Traci- 433. The hate on this blog is incited by Dooce and her stupidity, not John McCain. (She'll have you believe my comment stems from my "own issues," when in fact the issues I have are with her publicity stunts and see-through cries for attention.) Oh, and zero knowledge of the real election issues.

P.S. Everybody, check the stats and you'll see Democrats give much much less in charitible contributions than Republicans and have significantly higher rates of mental illness, the latter which is readily apparent.

657, Diana

Wow...you agree with everything Heather says? Is that kinda like the not-so-popular girl trying to ingratiate herself with the "it" girl? Everything? Really? Grow some balls.

FYI, the "religious right" is a mythical bogeyman created by leftists to increase political contributions. Agree? No? Well, that sounds ALOT like your theory of the "church" opposing abortion to create more donations. Idiotic.

Rock on sista? Wha? Does that make you feel a little more...liberal? Hip? Ethnic? Spare me.

661, Bev.

Thank you for sharing your story. Be careful, now. You are going against the feminist liberal orthodoxy and are now an 'open-season' target. You've shown you're not an "authentic" woman, and therefore are fair game for any attack, which has become liberal standard. You've shown more bravery than you know by telling these people what you went through.

Yes, Virginia, THAT is what passes for liberalism these days.

It confounds me to no end that many of your readers believe that I should have the right to choose to kill my baby before it is born, but I should not have the right to choose how to give my own money to people who need it.

I'm not competent enough to be responsible for my own money, but SURELY I should be allowed to terminate life, if I so choose. Oy.

~A woman voting for McCain

#650, get over yourself.

Consenting to sex is not consenting to pregnancy any more than getting in a car and driving is consenting to being in an auto accident.

I have children. Both were planned and wanted. One is dead.

So bite me. I'm pro-choice, because I don't think another woman's body is MY BUSINESS. Well, unless I'm currently shagging that woman. Then her body and her pleasure are totally my business.

Oh, and also, just so you know...God doesn't care whether or not you abort. Cause if he did, well then would he have given us the tools to do so? Yeah, didn't think so.

And with that, I'm off to bed.

Toodles.

Although I do see reasons for abortion (incest, rape and health) I am not pro-abortion and deeply resent the argument being made by "feminists" that this is the only issue that should matter in this election. This is not a one dimensional race and to reduce it as such is insulting.

"the courage of a pregnant mother to bring her child into the world"

When some of you heard such negativity in this statement, I heard something entirely different. I am raising two beautiful adopted sons thanks to the courage and selflessness of another woman.

Talon, for a second there I thought you were actually serious about this pressing issue o' the day.

Your flip comments about shagging chicks is a blatant attempt at sounding hip and cool and somehow minimizing the aspect of this debate. Again, I sympathize with the loss of your son but it has nothing to do with the argument at hand, nor does it give you some unquestionabel moral authority to weigh in.

Besides...by YOUR STATEMENT, if a man is shagging a chick and gets her pregnant, then HIS opinion regarding HER body is TOTALLY his business (YOU said if 'I'm shagging her then...her body is totally my business) then HE SHOULD HAVE A SAY IN WHETHER OR NOT THAT BABY IS CARRIED TO TERM. Somehow I think you disagree with that statement despite clearly stating the contrary. Just more inconsistent arguments from the pro-abortionists.

If not, I applaud your ideas regarding men having equal say in conceiving and raising children. Somehow I think that last sentence is wasted on you.

Uh...Ivan? Talon? Seriously. Get a room already.

Shocking to read a woman compare a fetus to a car wreck.

You are brainwashed. I hope you never come in contact with my child.

How is abortion rights at the front end of this election? Shit there are many other issues more pressing. I disagree with the Republican view on this but still. Palin's thoughts are bizzare to me but OK this isn't an abortion election.

There are much more important issues than abortion in this election. You chose to make it a main theme in this post but its not. Again I don't agree with Palin or McCain on this front but really we have bigger problems.

The economy is the issue and while you can blame Bush all you want it was the Democrats that pushed the Alt-A deals which corrupted the system...Pelosi, and Frank...I'll have to check on Dodd but I suspect that he too was involved. If you decide to check it out it was the sub-prime loans that they championed which opened up the flood gates. Lots of greedy brokers in general and on Wall Street who then sold them to banks and other Countries bought them. As long as the fees were coming in they were good. Stupid greedy bastards really but it was the democrats who opened up the credit envrionment to loan to people who weren't qualified. That's what tanked our economy if you care to look...or at the very least was the start of the downfall.

Iraq war...no prize either...just a pissing away of us...that one goes squarely on the shoulders of Bush. Glad its going better now but really...wasn't necessary.

Getting back to the economy. Do you know what this means?

You don't know me, of course, but I finance small businesses. Which means I help supply about 85% or more of all jobs in this country. Not me personally of course but in general.

Take for instance this:

I have a deal I'm trying to get financed for the construction of a shopping center. Total deal is about $50 million. Anchored by a major grocery store so that means there will be perhaps a couple of barber's or hair salon's probably a Starbucks but it already has an AutoZone and Burger King leased...most of the rest are smaller things...a dry cleaner and whatnot...you know the things that you see everyday. The borrower is very qualified and the terms I get for him now are stupid. I was embarrassed to even discuss them.

How does this apply to you? Fair enough question. When that shopping center gets built that means construction workers have jobs. The fees they pay to the city means the city workers get paid. The real benefit is this...people in the neighborhood have new services much closer to them if they choose to use them but really its this. I have no idea of how many people a supermarket employs and while most aren't terribly well paying jobs it does give an opportunity. They are the biggest employer in my example but think of the other places...Burger King...I'm sure there's a formula but new jobs. Other services...more jobs. Again lower paying jobs perhaps but who knows what kind of manufacturer or other service which might benefit from this. Its all integrated.

Take this one step further and more personal. When that deal closes I get a comission...I'm a photographer to (yes I'm not just some useless corporate guy) I use that to buy more lenses and whatnot. I also buy a trip to say for example to Arizona where I buy an airline ticket and hotel rooms and restaurants and tours.

Do you see how this works? I get to finance my shopping center which I get to sell off. The shopping center gets built and they in turn employ many (probably hundreds given shifts and whatnot). This encourages more expansion in the area as its now lively. I get my commission and I get to buy my equipment and take my trips. But more importantly than me the guy who did this might want to do this in another community. This creates more jobs for both construction and retail workers.

My point is this. You can bitch about Bush all you want and I won't argue you on this but what caused this was the downfall of the residential market which caused the demise of the commercial market.

Sorry but it was the democrats who caused it...argue with me all you want. It is what it is...If you want to do some research Alt-A was the major reason....look it up if you'd like.

I'm sure very few of you will read this...sorry to go against Heather whom I agree with on several aspects...this one is off.

Bush was no prize to be sure...'idiot' well...that's in play.

I know this started out as an abortion issue but really I never saw the point in that. The Supreme Court of this country hasn't overturned Rowe.v.Wade as far as I recall.

Pick a more relevant issue

Glenn

If any of you would watch the video where John McCain uses the dreaded air quotes, you would realize that he wasn't saying that the health of the mother is a hypothetical issue. He is saying that the law being written in a way that has an exception for the "health of the mother" provides a loophole for the selfish women who simply want the abortion.
Any women who goes about the act of getting pregnant puts herself at risk. Not only of pregnancy, but the chance that the pregnancy could go wrong. It's a horrible, horrible thing, a women dying during or because of a pregnancy. It's a tragedy, as is any death. However, the woman has had a chance to live, and she should have the decency to give that chance to the child.

So,
1)I'm a man.

2)Thursday night my wife's face glowed when she walked into my office with her hand behind her back. She had been costume shopping and I wondered what she was going to try to make me wear... But Nope We're Pregnant!

3)I've been starring at her belly for the past two days in a space between ,love, marvel, fear, "holy sh*t!",inquiry... However, I've had to think about the abortion issue in an honest way I hadn't before.

4)I have been and continue to be Pro-Choice

5)I am also Pro-Life... (Seriously, Who the hell isn't?) They are not mutually exclusive. Obama said, "No one is for abortion." I believe it's true.

6)My wife and I (little one included) are both Pro-Obama

Note:
I am starting my own blog inspired by dooce!... http://intraveina.com

Brad

@Katie #647 and all those anti-choicers who agree abortion should be allowed in cases of "rape or incest"...

Think long and hard about what you're REALLY saying, which is, essentially, that women who WILLINGLY have unprotected sex should be legally punished with an unwanted pregnancy and forced to carry that pregnancy to term... but women who UNWILLINGLY have unprotected sex shouldn't be punished at all, but be allowed to make their own very private decisions.

The unspoken (yet VERY clear) issue at stake isn't "life" and when it begins, or any other angels-on-the-head-of-a-pin philosophical discussion, but rather the control of women's sexuality and reproductive autonomy (an ancient concern, by the way, if any of you care to do some actual research).

Either you're "pro-life" or you're not. The "rape/incest" cop-out is moral relativism at its very WORST.

Now, I'm solidly pro-choice and vote accordingly, but I have to say that I have a lot more respect, ethically, for those who oppose abortion and don't make exceptions based on a woman's sexual behavior. The "rape/incest" crowd are creepy sexists who don't even KNOW they're creepy sexists; sadly, they think they're "humane."

It seems that both links posted refer specifically to rare events that would make abortion the logical, safest choice. Infections, pregnancy complications... many in the comments have mentioned incest etc. Termination of pregnancy under these conditions should not be prevented by law.

However, I wonder how many abortions performed each year actually fall into these categories and how many human lives are terminated for the sake of convenience?

I believe that human life is a precious commodity. I have adopted 3 children... I thank my God every day that their First Mothers chose life.

Ohhh I see we did get under Ivan's skin. I pity people like you, Ivan. Stop generalizing, you fuckin idiot.

Pro-lifer here - I certainly don't consider myself "disconnected" - absolutely voting for McCain, for many reasons. Doesn't make me enjoy your blog any less, I just happen to have a completely opposite, though just as intelligent and informed opinion as some others posting here. I think it's cool to see so many others doing their homework, and voting the issues and what truly matters to them. I respect every informed voter, even if we cancel each other out!

The number one cause of death amongst pregnant women is murder. I didn't believe it at first, but I looked it up and found it is verifiable fact. If murder doesn't constitute a threat to a woman's health, nothing does. I am by no means "pro-abortion", nor is anyone I know, but I believe that my pro-choice stance has a lot to do with respecting life, even that overlooked constituency of grown women's lives.

Thanks for occasionally going political, Dooce. Yours is a much-heard voice, and you use it well.

I respect your right to add politics to your blog. As a mother, I agree it's imperative we discuss these things.

Two things swayed me completely away from McCain: Sarah Palin and this article from Rolling Stone:

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/coverstory/make_believe_maverick_the_re...

Quite clearly 696 did not read the articles linked in this blog.

I think a lot of people leaving comments did not read the articles linked in this blog...

Heather's post isn't about abortion...at least not in the way the commenters seem to be suggesting. The government has absolutely no business trying to legislate an individual's health decisions. As it happens, the health decisions in the above mentioned posts happened to deal with terminating pregnancies. Had they been something else, say how the government wants to legislate how to treat cancer, I wonder what these comments would look like.

Abortion, like many other topics in today's society, is not a black and white issue...so many different stories, so many shades of gray. But it just goes to show how divisive our country has become. When this election is all said and done, we all have to live here together. It would be nice if we could all show a little tolerance.

A few thoughts on this:
1. McCain's political stance is "safe, legal, and rare" - I find it hard to disagree with that, regardless of how little he understands the issue on a personal level.
2. Roe v Wade was a mistake - to be clear, I'm pro-choice, but according to the US Constitution, the legislative branch had no right to rule on that case. Abortion is supposed to be under the jurisdiction of congress, or the states. (Since no one has ever challenged Roe v Wade on this basis, I doubt it's going away anytime soon.)
3. Given point two above, the president has virtually no ability to impact whether abortion remains legal or not. So making this an issue that impacts your vote for president is pointless and detrimental to the many other issues the president CAN impact. Ask your congressional candidates about their views. Don't ask your presidential candidates - they don't matter on this issue.
4. Palin is pro-life... but since she won't be able to impact my ability to choose an abortion (either as VP or as Prez), I don't see this as a reason to vote or not vote for McCain.

This is why I hoped Guliani would make the ticket. Republicans are supposed to be about keeping the power at the state level and less control over our everyday lives at the federal level. What's happened to t he Republican party?

Carrie #699--"The government has absolutely no business trying to legislate an individual's health decisions."

So true. The idea behind your statement makes me wonder why people want to allow the government to legislate health care. Nationlized/socialized health care is a joke. Why would anyone want the government deciding when they can consult with a doctor, which one they can see, and whether the treatment they require is authorized? My uterus isn't the only body part that I want the government to steer clear of.

Interesting side note: I've noticed as I've read through these comments that some of you are actually Libertarians (like me)and probably don't even realize it.

Very heavy stuff. Strong points of view. Thank you for the post

Wait, you want the government out of your uteruses...but in your business, mandating where you get your health care, and deciding exactly when your kid can get that health-improving procedure under a national health care system? That's how it works in countries with National Health care systems. I have a friend who lives in Ireland and you know what? No cozy birth plans there. She was told, "You get a midwife and gas, that's it because that's what we have." No doctor on call; a surgeon in the hospital just in case.

I find it funny that the same people who want the government to swoop in and solve everybody's health care and money issues, want that same government to stay the hell away from unborn babies who don't deserve to die.

Oh, and for the record, I'm against the bailout. Stupidest idea Congress and Bush ever thought up.

I'm a woman, and I'm voting for McCain/Palin. Because if we don't worry about protecting the most vulnerable individuals in our society, all the puffery about helping others with our tax dollars, spreading the wealth around, and taxing those rich small business owners means nothing. At all. We live in a culture of death, and that's a crying shame.

i have to weigh in on this one. i think there is never a reason for partial birth abortion when the fetus is viable. some of these abortions are done on fetuses that are of viability like the 23 plus weekers i take care of in my NICU. i say deliver the baby for the health of the mother if needed, not kill it. read about partial birth abortion. it's heinous. they are delivering everything but the head then killing the baby by sucking it brains out.

dooce i've read your blog for years. i cannot read it anymore. i am appalled by you and your followers. your uterus rights and a living human being are two different things. also i guess it's easy to be for it when you're safe from the womb.

best wishes. i will not be returning.

As a life long republican who believes in a woman's right to make her own choices on what happens to her body, I agree that this is certainly not the issue that should make or break your decision on who to vote for in November. Neither candidate is going to become King and change everything in the ol' good USA all by themselves.

For those who have not yet decided who you are voting for this year, have you not found your thinking cap yet? It's not like we are talking about choosing between Geroge Clooney and Brad Pitt. There are not going to be any big revelations in the next couple weeks unless you are planing on McCain dying of old age next week and the ticket becoming Palin - Fey.

Thank you for posting this. I think this election is going to be extremely important and your blog is read by so many different people that if even one person is changed by what you've said then that is a good thing. Keep doing what you are doing!

Did I miss the part of Obama's health care proposal that says the government will be responsible for choosing our doctors? I thought the premise was to make health insurance available to those who need it by allowing them to have the same plan that government employees enjoy.

Our government controls our military. Our government mandates our public school system. (How many of you crying "socialist" would be able to afford to put your children in private schools if the public school system was not available?) And now the bailout! Why is it that the government shouldn't be able to devise a system to provide health insurance to those who wouldn't otherwise be able to afford it??

Socialism is already at play in our society today...it's all relative.

Dear #717 Carrie,
If the public school system was not available, we could use the tax money we each spend supporting that system to put our children in private school.

@ #719 - Sure, in a perfect world. Tax dollars would be allocated exactly how they should. I mean, I'm sure that money wouldn't go to something else...like a government bailout of failed banks and insurance companies...

Gah! I hate the idea that we need legislation to stop women pretending to have health issues to get an abortion. Is it because he doesn't believe there are any situations where pregnancy can kill? History is just full of women dying in childbirth.

Maybe he thinks that we women make up health problems all the time to use abortion as birth control. Because abortions are easier, cheaper, more comfortable physically and emotionally, and more accessible than using a condom

And STILL the comments in this thread about "Partial birth abortion" are laughable. People have really bought into this fallacy!! Even people who supposedly work in the medical field!! That is just insane.

All the more reason for the choice to be between the woman and her doctor.

For those of you not in the know...early induction for a BABY...a wanted, planned baby who will not survive outside the womb does not always work. Hell everyone here should know that inductions for HEALTHY full term babies don't always work!! There is a reason that this proceedure is rare in the first place. Because situations where it is the best option are RARE.

"Just deliver it!! It's like the premature babies I take care of in the NICU!!" Use your brains, people. If it were that simple...don't you think they'd do it? Oh, and if a parent decides not to put their very premature baby through all the pain and uncertinaty and such of trying to save them, guess what. They don't have to. Some choose to let their children die naturally and peacefully in their arms rather than subject them to that.

Ivan, I DO enjoy debating this with you, and I apologize that my flippant little bit of very late at night humor did not have the intended effect. Like everything else concerning pregnancy, I believe the man involved has exactly as much say as the woman allows him to have. Once the sperm left his body, his say in what happens is done, unless the woman decides otherwise. There is no clause for biological fairness, as we aren't seahorses, regretfully.

Heather~~After reading all the comments, I'm a little scared for your safety. Please lock your doors and hug your family tight. There are lunatics out there! Be safe and stay brave.

Talon,

I have no idea why are you refusing to see how sick and unnecessary a late term abortion is. My husband is a doctor, I can assure you there is VERY RARELY (as in such a small percentage it's not even recordable) a situation in which a mother's health would be at issue delivering a second or third trimester fetus. Ob/gyn doctors are surgeons. If they unsuccessfully induce a woman or there is a situation that is life-threatening, they would, especially in an emergency, perform an emergency caesarian. It happens every day in every hospital in this country. I've known women who have opted, with fetal demise during pregnancy, to be induced and deliver. Those women would NOT have to have this procedure. They would simply give birth or have a c-section. The ONLY reason to have this procedure done is to KILL the baby. Bottom line. NO way you can argue any other way.

I quote from a medical ethics textbook given to many physicians during training Talon!

"...the consensus is that most late-term abortions are immoral."

"The defining characteristic of late-term abortions is that the fetus is either viable or periviable, that is, able or possibly able to survive outside the uterus. By this time the fetal human body has developed neurological centers for perception and Doppler studies of blood flow in the brain after the 18th week strongly suggest that fetuses experience distress during invasive procedures on the fetal trunk."

"A fetus subject to late term abortion is sentient and hence exists as a human being sensing its environment."

Doctors take an oath, the Hippocratic Oath, to preserve life. It is against what every doctor is trained to do, vows to do and does each day, to KILL a human being...no matter what state of development or under any circumstance. Very rarely in modern medicine would a physician have to choose between the life of one of it's patients...because both the mother and baby are his/her patients. Medicine is equipped to handle BOTH and would attempt to in any necessary situation. You are incredibly naive, in denial or purely monstorous in your view of what this procedure actually is...does. It simply is a way, MUCH TOO LATE, for a woman to avoid being a mother. Whether that baby would be viable, deformed, perfectly fine, there is no reason that anyone should ever be allowed to have this done. It is beyond inhuman, it is abominable.

By the way, do you realize why they keep the head in the uterus as they crush the skull? Honestly, it isn't because they need to "pull the head out". Be sensible, a woman's cervix is made to stretch and open...it could easily pass a mid term fetus!!! It is because, as along as the baby is killed semi- in utero, the killing peformed by the doctor can't be classified as murder. If a doctor purposefully takes an object and rams it into a human beings skull, no matter what the law is about abortion or what the mother asks him to do, it would be murder! He couldn't smother the baby either, give it an injection, stomp on it with his foot. He can withhold care, technically, and let the baby dies on it's on, if it's under the whole guise of abortion. But once the baby is out...takes a breath, is alive at all, outside of it's mother and the doctor acts in a way to cease life, it IS murder. Sorry to burst your bubble on this compassionate procedure. You are FULL of shit.

And I'm pro-choice mind you. And for those interested, this is the oath my husband took, and most all doctor's take unless they opt not to (I don't know any that haven't). They do this in a ceremony, together, as a group, and are given a signed oath to keep. My husband's hangs in his office. He acts in good faith on that oath each and every day:

I swear by Apollo Physician and Asclepios and Hygeia and Panacea and all the gods and goddesses, making them my witnesses, that I will fulfill according to my ability and judgment this oath and this covenant:

To hold him who has taught me this art as equal to my parents and to live my life in partnership with him, and if he is in need of money to give him a share of mine, and to regard his offspring as equal to my brothers in male lineage and to teach them this art - if they desire to learn it - without fee and covenant; to give a share of precepts and oral instruction and all the other learning to my sons and to the sons of him who has instructed me and to pupils who have signed the covenant and have taken an oath according to the medical law, but no one else.

I will apply dietetic measures for the benefit of the sick according to my ability and judgment; I will keep them from harm and injustice.

I will neither give a deadly drug to anybody who asked for it, nor will I make a suggestion to this effect. Similarly I will not give to a woman an abortive remedy. In purity and holiness I will guard my life and my art.

I will not use the knife, not even on sufferers from stone, but will withdraw in favor of such men as are engaged in this work.

Whatever houses I may visit, I will come for the benefit of the sick, remaining free of all intentional injustice, of all mischief and in particular of sexual relations with both female and male persons, be they free or slaves.

What I may see or hear in the course of the treatment or even outside of the treatment in regard to the life of men, which on no account one must spread abroad, I will keep to myself, holding such things shameful to be spoken about.

If I fulfill this oath and do not violate it, may it be granted to me to enjoy life and art, being honored with fame among all men for all time to come; if I transgress it and swear falsely, may the opposite of all this be my lot.

They're alled D&C's and hospitals do them and call them that even if it's an abortion. No president can overturn RvW because the Supreme Court won't touch it because of its 35 year precedence. Do your research.

Obama spent 143 days in office before he launched his empty campaign. I'm a democrat voting for McCain, you know, someone who has actually BEEN at his job.

No one will end this war in less than 2 years. Do your research.

"695. Mother of 2, Maine said:
I respect your right to add politics to your blog. As a mother, I agree it's imperative we discuss these things.

Two things swayed me completely away from McCain: Sarah Palin and this article from Rolling Stone:

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/coverstory/make_believe_maverick_the_re..."

Anyone who would let an article in "Rolling Stone Magazine" influence their vote shouldn't really be voting in my opinion.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4188/is_20080727/ai_n27961227

http://www.thehotjoints.com/2008/07/14/double-standard-what-about-the-ro...

http://www.nowpublic.com/culture/rolling-stone-endorses-obama

http://www.slate.com/id/2134921/

The fact that anyone would admit in public that they were gathering political information and knowledge from "Rolling Stone" is unbelievable to me. Would you look for medical information in "BEtter Homes and Gardens"? Jeesh, people, look for some REAL, UNBIASED sources. Or maybe Mother of 2, Maine would just like to ask Kayne West how he would vote~~ LOL

Even though I come from a Muslim background, in which abortion views align with Pro-Life views, I do believe in a woman's right to choose. I do not think everyone is meant to be a mother or raise child.

Tedders--Thank you. I thought the very same thing when I read that post. It is frightening to realize how many people get their information from such dubious sources, or are swayed by the likes of pop stars and 'political entertainers'. I even saw a so-called news story on CNN asking the question, "How much do the SNL skits influence voters?". REALLY?? I can't even fathom living, breathing human beings being influenced by what they watch on a comedy skit. Please, people, put more effort into your decisions. Read factual, unbiased information regarding all of the issues before you go into the voting booth. Don't take the word of your favorite actor, talk show host, rapper, or even blogger as the truth. Educate yourself and make your own informed decision.

I can't help myself these days. I feel like I'm commenting on all of your political blogs lately, but here I goes again...

I am a woman who intends to vote for McCain and instead of boring you with all of my disagreements with Obama's policies, I'll just focus on abortion.

I am pro-life. I believe that every human has the right to life, regardless of the circumstances of his/her conception. Call me naive, but I believe there is a family out there that will adopt that child if the birth parents don't want or cannot take care of him/her. Adoption should be made easier in this country, not irresponsibly so, but enough so that it is a REAL option for birth parents and adoptive parents. Enough of the red tape and outrageous cost!

Now, on the other hand, I am pro-choice. I believe that women and men have birth control options and their right to choose is made before conception of an unwanted pregnancy. This argument, of course, excludes those who are victims of rape and incest.

My husband and I successfully avoided an unwanted pregnancy for years by using birth control. It is not rocket science. I realize that not all methods are 100%, but when used correctly, birth control in all forms is highly effective.

Birth control should be cheap, if not free, and available to women and men. I believe that schools should teach both abstinence and about all birth control options. Perhaps they should even teach about abortion; what it really looks like...especially in late term pregnancy.

Finally, abortion in the case of the mother's life is already legal. That is such a moot point. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doe_v._Bolton. This Supreme Court decision also applies to those who conceive due to rape or incest; "medical judgment may be exercised in the light of all factors - physical, emotional, psychological, familial, and the woman's age - relevant to the wellbeing of the patient. All these factors may relate to health."

If McCain is elected, he will not be able to overturn Roe v. Wade or Doe v. Bolton. The "worst" that would happen is that he would nominate libertarian supreme court justices who, if abortion was brought back before the Court, would kick the issue back to the states since the constitution does not address the issue. That's what should have been done in 1973.
.

I tried to read the comments to see if I'm just repeating what someone else wrote, but I started to get a little ill at all the vitriol.

I think that there are lots of great reasons to vote for Obama and not to vote for McCain, but Roe v. Wade is not the central issue here. It's not even the central issue in terms of women's rights and which candidate will better support them.

I do think that if McCain gets elected, croaks, and Palin takes over, she will do a horrible job. Not because she's a woman, but because she sucks. And THAT will mean that there won't be a woman anywhere near the White House for another 20 years, because people would say, "Oh, Palin was so awful" and blame it on her being a woman.

That's my personal feminist worst nightmare scenario.

For all of those who think McCain won't be able to make a difference re abortion, please be clear HE WILL - because he will appoint at least 2 more judges to the Supreme Court.

The court is currently split 4-4-1 (4 conservatives: Thomas, Scalia, Alito, Roberts vs. 4 liberals: Ginsberg, Breyer, Stevens and Souter; 1 quasi-independent: Kennedy).

Note that liberals Stevens and Ginsberg are both very old and ill -- both are rumored to retire in the next administration. leaving TWO LIBERAL openings for our next president.

First, Roe v. Wade is a Supreme Court case -- so only another Supreme Court decision can overturn it.

The ONLY thing keeping abortion from being overruled is one more CONSERVATIVE VOTE. Right now, you have a vote SPLIT RIGHT DOWN THE MIDDLE: 4 abolish Roe, 4 keep Roe, and 1 who tries to wordsmith his away around it (Kennedy).

All McCain needs to do is appoint another Scalia or Alito --and POOF Roe is OVERTURNED.

All you need is:
(1) McCain replacing one of the liberals for a conservative judge
(2) the pro-life movement to bring a case and appeal it to the Supreme Court (this will take 1-2 yrs to happen)
(3) Poof: Roe v. Wade is gone.

I am pro-choice and an attorney and this scares the be-jesus out of me. And abortion will just the start of it all. Last year, the Supreme Court case Ledbetter case abolished equal pay for equal work for women (google it--- it's astonishing how women -- esp working class women focus on abortion and forget there is a whole wide universe of issues out there where we stand to get hurt if conservatives take hold)

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE realize the next President will pick 2 more Justices -- that to me is probably the most important reason to educate yourself on the issues -- bec that is a LOT of power.

At least McCain is thinking about protecting the lives of the unborn babies. What about their right to live?

and neither of them have a uterus

Food for thought...

Are any of the readers who are voting for Obama worried about moving towards a more socialized healthcare system in light of our country's sub-par public education system?

In other words, are you at all worried that the same government who funds/runs our public schools would have more control over your healthcare options?

http://www.palinaspresident.us/

Click on the items in the picture and Ms Palin will talk to you...

Be prepared to LYAO.

I like Dooce much more without the political drama.

@Julie. I agree, it's getting old. The site isn't what it was even a few months ago. Turning this into a political platform is not creative, it's not funny, and it's not entertaining. And it doesn't have any impact on who I am going to vote for. I get the facts for myself. I do not trust ANYONE to decide my vote for me. I miss the enjoyable read this site was a few months ago. It use to be something I looked forward to daily. I miss reading about someone who has the same daily struggles with motherhood and being a wife that I do. I just don't give a rats ass what anyone else's feelings on politics are and if did I would go to CNN. I guess I just miss something I had looked forward to reading each day.

Ehem...#349..You say that all we have to do is educate ourselves on HOW not to get pregnant. You follow that statement by saying that all we have to do is abstain from sex "a couple of days" out of the month. OK, sadly, you are EXACTLY the person who will find herself pregnant and not understand how it happened. YOU need to educate yourself on how not to get pregnant. First of all, you can be fertile for more than "a couple of days" out of the month. Hell, you can OVULATE more than once in a month! Moreover, sperm can and DO live in the female body for more than "a couple of days" after sex occurs. And finally, there is no 100% sure way to know when you are fertile...I got pregnant THE DAY after my period. I mean the very next day! And I was on birth control.... what were the odds???? Please do a lot more than abstain from sex "a couple of days" a month if you are not 100% ready to make the very difficult decision whether or not you are ready to be a parent.

Man, the comments always get so heated when you blog politics. I love it! You could swing an election with you traffic!

Go Obama. You've got this on in the bag.

Heather --

After reading your "mortified" post, it occured to me that now you are an exact mirror image of that girl. You freaked out about how far to the right you were, but now I'm think you're just as brainwashed by the extreme liberals as you once were by the extreme rightwingers or your mormon faith.

You were extreme and intolerant then. You are extreme and intolerant now. Not a whole lot has changed.

--a person who is NOT voting for McCain and is still disgusted by your political rants.

[This is from a friend's site today. She's at http://held-prisoner-in-hampton-roads.blogspot.com/ ]

OK, I lied . . .

. . . about no more politics.

However, my intent is not to argue McCain/Obama, but to make a general statement of what I believe in government, and to my friends abroad, it is not the European Model. Sorry. This is the list of "Cannots" oft quoted by both Abraham Lincoln and Ronald Reagan.

"You cannot bring prosperity by discouraging thrift.
You cannot help small men by tearing down big men.
You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong.
You cannot lift the wage earner by pulling down the wage payer.
You cannot help the poor man by destroying the rich.
You cannot keep out of trouble by spending more than your income.
You cannot further brotherhood of men by inciting class hatred.
You cannot establish security on borrowed money.
You cannot build character and courage by taking away man's initiative and independence.
You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves."

- Rev. William J. H. Boetcker

Apply that to candidates as you will . . .

[Wouldn't it be awesome if we took these things into consideration before we vote.]

McCain is horrible. Vote Obama '08.

And another thing... I am certainly pro-choice and I think the government should not interfere in choices that I make about my body, but I don't understand how the majority of pro-choice women seem to also be pro-universal healthcare which would turn healthcare choices ENTIRELY over to the government. Heather, how do you justify that position? How can you think that it's wrong for the government to decide about abortion, but think that it's a great idea for the government to decide about every other aspect of healthcare, including who has access to it and what treatment is appropriate, etc? Seems like such a giant glaring contradiction.

I have found your blog somewhat entertaining- I however find that your political views are very uneducated. Clearly you do not understand that a President -any president will ever be able to reverse Roe vs. Wade, and it shouldn't be. You clearly not read Obama's books, nor his tax plan. I have and for anyone to vote for someone that supports "live" abortion and redistributing wealth is ridiculous, as well as the fact that in a published book he ridicules his own grandmother. I put myself and my husband through grad school why in the world should I now have to pay for someone who CHOSE not to grow their own income is beyond my comprehension. Clearly you make less than 250,000 a year and maybe you do not need to worry about your income taxes increasing. Guess what- when I have to pay more taxes I am going to spend less money on consumables and all of the people including my cleaner that I recently let go are not going to have jobs. So keep on supporting the person that is going to drive the economy futher into the toilet- good choice!!!

Breathtaking how many people say in the same breath: "We can't have the government running health care" and "we must late the state decide what you can do with your uterus!" Make up your minds!
Want to leave it up to the states? Check out what's happening in South Dakota:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztfn-kayOps

really?? I came to this site after reading an article about the founder in Hybrid Moms...I just want to say I am so disappointed. The first thing I read is why any women should not vote for McCain. OK thanks for nothing

#300

Tiggerlane -

Woman who are insulted by John McCain's choice of running mate are catering to their real power brokers - liberal men. And how fun it is to be sexist to Sarah Palin! Anything goes when one is a Republican, don't it?

Abortion has been legal in Canada for 20 years. And amazingly, women keep having babies. Maybe all that legal access to abortion hasn't led to the extinction of the species after all.

Canada's socialized medical system means the same access to prenatal care for EVERY woman, regardless of their socioeconomic status. And get this, when you DO have a baby, you're entitled to 12 months (not weeks - MONTHS) of maternity leave. Another perk!